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Re: image 2

Postby gajojo » Wed Sep 28, 2016 11:22 pm

Dero’s post has encouraged me to post my thoughts on the Charleston casque. I have not thoroughly read through all past posts so I apologize if my thoughts are old news. I discovered The Secret and this forum in January ’16 so I am definitely late to this party. I do think it is so cool that some of you have been at this for decades now. And I have figured out that a lot of ya’ll are working together off the grid, which makes it not as fun for some of us newbies that would love to have your latest thoughts. That being said, I would love feedback.

When I first started looking at the Charleston image, I found it frustrating because it didn’t seem to have things drawn in the image like the fencepost for the Chicago casque. I then found on the forum that a good number of people thought that the Charleston casque was in WPG so I took the verse, ignored the image, and decided that it was in one of three places. My best guess (without actually visiting WPG) was that it was across the street from where the USS Maine Capstan once stood on East Battery. Before too long, I discovered another forum where someone named Bone Structure had already come up with the same place and a number of people had concluded she was right. Sadly, I then found photos of the spot being completely rebuilt after the hurricane. If it was in that spot, it is now most assuredly gone.

While waiting on the opportunity to go to WPG to check out my other two spots, Erexere posted a message that had to do with geometric lines. I began wondering if I could find something in Image 2 that would function as instructions that would lead one to WPG via lines. Once I had my theory, I went to WPG and upon actually going through the city, I eliminated two of my three options of dig spots (including my original top choice spot.) Ironically, the verse currently has me questioning whether or not WPG is correct, although I am convinced the image takes you to WPG.

FYI, I have no idea what I am doing regarding posting pictures. I have attempted to put pictures in an album in photobucket. I hope it works.

Once again, some of you likely figured all this out in the 80’s. Forgive me if this is old news. Here is my attempt to decipher the image:

A) The most obvious landmark in Image 2 is Fort Sumter. Therefore, start there.
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... wbkqmi.jpg

B) From Fort Sumter, take the return ferry to the the ferry's departure point: http://www.fortsumtertours.com/quick-answers/
The ferry departs and returns in Downtown Charleston at Liberty Square’s Fort Sumter Visitors Center, 340 Concord St. Charleston, SC 29401
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... bv9oz9.jpg

C) 340 Concord intersects with Calhoun Street.
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... pypf3e.jpg

Note: There is a flagpole that is surrounded by a semicircle—I have no idea if the ears of the lion represent this, but you do pass it on the way to Calhoun Street. (Flag pole is in between B and C. On map it says Freedom Lane.)
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... wmu033.jpg

Once on Calhoun Street, head to King Street which is represented by lion in image 2. http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... 0ltqv8.jpg

D) Before you get to King Street, you will come to Meeting Street. I believe that the “h” in the mask is referring to the Hampton Obelisk, which is on Calhoun and Meeting. http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... jlg8jn.jpg
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... ccoszd.jpg
Hampton Obelisk
Date Created/Placed: 1911
Address:
Calhoun and Meeting st.
Charleston South Carolinia
(Marion Square)
Height: 30 ft.

(There are two obelisks in Charleston, hence the need for the h in image 2. http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WM4HNK The other one is on Broad and Meeting. http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WM45 ... h_Carolina)

-When you see the “h” landmark on Calhoun (Hampton Obelisk), turn Left on Meeting Street and head toward White Point Garden (represented by the white on the moth or butterfly).
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... 1q9oaw.jpg

Note: Meeting Street is parallel to King Street. The h in the nose of the mask (Hampton Obelisk) is parallel to the nose of the lion (King Street). Also, the top of the h on the map is very near where the obelisk actually is if you look at a city map of Charleston.).

E) On Meeting Street, on the way to WPG, you will pass Gibbes Museum of Art. I believe the girl in Image 2 is a reference to the statue outside the Museum. I copied picture from animal painter’s Oct 18, 2009 post. At some point, I read something about the girl being a nod to the Flying Charleston and the Hand to Hand Charleston (dances). I thought that was pretty clever.
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... asqs7i.jpg

Stay on Meeting, keep heading to WPG.
F) From Meeting Street, cross the street into WPG.
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... qnvjga.jpg

From this point, we need verse 6.

To be continued…
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Re: image 2

Postby gajojo » Thu Sep 29, 2016 12:09 am

Continued.
I don’t have a clue what some of the verse means; maybe some of you can help me. Most of this is on the forum already.

I am using the numbers in the landmark map to indicate what I am referring to.
If you would like to see pictures of some of the landmarks, here is a link: http://thesecret.pbworks.com/w/page/108 ... 0Landmarks.

White Point Garden is where they hung the pirates.
Of all the romance retold – Treasure Island
Men of tales and tunes –What kind of men? Sailors
Cruel and bold—What kind of sailors? Pirates
Seen here—Pirates were seen here hanging for several days.
By eyes of old—a long time ago.

When you step into WPG from Meeting Street, the first thing you see is the Hunley Memorial that has a fountain (17). If you keep walking, you come to a gazebo that once served as a Band Stand (18).

Stand and listen to the birds: I assume “stand” refers to the band stand(18). I have no idea what time of year BP was in Charleston, but I did find a website that stated that Yellow Crowned Night Herons nest every year in the oak trees in WPG. Maybe BP was there during this season?? Does anyone have any other ideas what the bird reference could be?
http://glimpsesofcharleston.com/we-just ... -they-are/


Hear the cool, clear song of water: I am assuming that this refers to either the Hunley fountain (17) and/or the river, ocean and harbor on the other side of the bandstand (low battery on map). Standing in the bandstand, you will have water on both sides. I am assuming the “clear song” refers to bandstand.

Harken the words: From the bandstand, head to to the Simms statue (16). Simms was a famous writer and orater, hence “Harken the words.”

I am wondering if BP is giving us four points, and that the casque is buried between the four points.

Point A (15) --Freedom at the birth of a century: No real clue, but I will throw out two thoughts. 1) I have wondered if this could refer to Liberia (in that Liberia means freedom). I don’t think it could have referred to Simms since from everything I have read, he was pro slavery. However, the verse seems to move to a contrast thing with the “Ors”, so maybe there is an intentional comparison of freedom vs. slavery—but how this line helps us find a casque is beyond me. 2) My other thought is that maybe “Freedom at the birth of a century” could refer to the Jasper Monument (15). Jasper distinguished himself in the defense of Fort Moultrie (then called Fort Sullivan) on June 28, 1776. Thomas Jefferson's wrote the Declaration of Independence in June of 1776. BP published the book in 1982. That is pretty close to the bicentennial. Could it be a nod toward 1776?—I wonder if that year is anywhere on the Jasper Monument. Century—100 years? Bicentennial—200 years? I know—it is a bad stretch, but from my perspective, this line either has nothing to do with any landmark in WPG (rather a Liberia reference) or it is has to do with the Jasper Monument.

Point B (8)--Or May 1913: This date was on the USS Maine Capstan.(was once located at #8)

Point C--Edwin and Edwina named after him: Edward Wilmot Blyden had a connection with both Liberia and Charleston. Blyden, like Simms, was also an author. Unlike Simms, he was not pro-slavery. This is my most ridiculous idea: This line has either nothing to do with a landmark in WPG (rather a Liberia reference) or could it be a weird reference to the fraternal twin looking palms near the spot where the USS Maine Capstan once stood.
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... xng8x3.jpg

Point D (3)--Or on the eighth a scene
Where law defended: I think this refers to the small monument about pirates that is on South Battery. It is almost parallel to the twin palms.

I think that there is something significant about the “OR”s, but I don’t know what.

Once you are in between those four points, get between two arms extended.

Between two arms extended: I think this is referring to the long cannons that the USS Maine sat between (7) and (9). I know that some have speculated that the two arms could be the arms on the statues. I think the picture of the moth or butterfly in Image 2 tell us that the two arms are cannons. You can see the two cannons in the picture with the twin palms. http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... xng8x3.jpg

Below the bar that binds: I am assuming that this is referring to the capstan that is no longer there (8). It could be referring to the battery wall. This may be a stretch as well, but I am assuming it means that the casque is buried in the sand along this path.

Beside the long palm's shadow: Initially, I saw this as having two options: either the palm of a hand on one of the statues or the really tall palm in WPG. If it was referring to the really tall palm, I wanted to see where the shadow of the tree fell at 4 pm. I thought maybe it would fall or point across the street toward the battery wall. I took this picture at 4 pm. http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... dww5mx.jpg
Even if BP was there during a different time of year (spring forward or fall back Day light saving time), I don’t think the shadow is going to fall on anything near sand.

Seeing the shadow of the really tall palm eliminated my thoughts that the casque could have been buried a) across the street by the battery wall or b) near the capstan. Both of those place would have been beneath a bar that binds and between two arms extended. I was quite happy to find that the shadow of the tall palm did not point to where the USS Maine Capstan once stood because I was concerned that the casque would have been destroyed if there was any digging to replace it with the other monument.

Side note: I have wondered if the flat center of the daisy referred to the Fort Sumter Monument at the corner of Murray Blvd and East Battery. (In the shadow of the tall palm picture above, the top of the shadow of the tall palm touched it.) I have seen aerial pictures of WPG where that monument looks like a flat disk. The monument is surrounded by what looks like 16 concrete petals. In image 2, the daisy has 17 petals. One is bent. When I look at it, it reminds me of “He loves me, He loves me not,” like I need to pull one off. No idea if this is what JPP was trying to convey. If there was sand around that monument in the 80’s, maybe the spot beside the shadow of the tall palm is significant.

Finally—where I think the casque could be buried:
I think that the long palm’s shadow may be referring to the hand on the Jasper monument. https://www.flickr.com/photos/hunky_punk/9263287324
Beside the long palm’s shadow, meaning in front of the extended fingers, there is a bricked in bed of greenery. http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... fyny8y.jpg If the shrubs are planted the same way underneath the statue as they were in the 80’s, there is a clear spot where a casque could have been buried. http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... 1etjzk.jpg
I would not have thought BP would bury something in a bed of bushes, but he did with the one Egbert dug up. If it was buried there, it may still be safe after the hurricane. My problem with this is that I grew up near the beach. And I would see the garden bed as being filled with dirt, rather than sand. However, right outside that garden bed is the long path through WPG that could easily be called sand—though it is extremely packed and hard sand. I wonder if the casque is buried right beside the extended hand in the sand. http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... h0kgmc.jpg
Embedded in the sand, Waits the Fair remuneration, White house close at hand:
What convinced me that this is most likely the spot is that while I was standing there taking pictures, I glanced to right to see a building that looked a lot like a miniature White House close at hand. The white house called the Villa Marguerita on the corner of Church Street and South Battery is parallel to the spot.
http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... ul5nyn.jpg
I was not standing right next to the Jasper Monument when I took the picture of the white house. But it is the closest house to the Jasper Monument. Also, you can see a tall palm in the picture, but it's shadow would not be near two arms extended.

Does anyone know if someone has tried to dig up this spot? Would love to have ya’lls thoughts. Please let me know if I need to clarify anything or if the pictures do not work. New to this.
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Re: image 2

Postby tjgrey » Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:30 am

gajojo wrote:B) From Fort Sumter, take the return ferry to the the ferry's departure point: http://www.fortsumtertours.com/quick-answers/
The ferry departs and returns in Downtown Charleston at Liberty Square’s Fort Sumter Visitors Center, 340 Concord St. Charleston, SC 29401


On this topic...the ferry didn't depart from Concord st in the '80s, nor was that entire plaza near the aquarium there. I think it was built around 2005...

gajojo wrote:E) On Meeting Street, on the way to WPG, you will pass Gibbes Museum of Art. I believe the girl in Image 2 is a reference to the statue outside the Museum. I copied picture from animal painter’s Oct 18, 2009 post. At some point, I read something about the girl being a nod to the Flying Charleston and the Hand to Hand Charleston (dances). I thought that was pretty clever.


I've long thought of the Gibbes (and museums in other casques' locations) as very important. My theory is, BP visited and used local pieces of art to "influence" or as some base material from some of the images.

gajojo wrote:Stay on Meeting, keep heading to WPG.
F) From Meeting Street, cross the street into WPG.

From this point, we need verse 6.


I like your path...I think Meeting is the most obvious, and using images and then the verse as a starting point at the park is good...and consistent with Cleveland and Chicago.
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Re: image 2

Postby tjgrey » Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:55 am

gajojo wrote:White Point Garden is where they hung the pirates.
Of all the romance retold – Treasure Island
Men of tales and tunes –What kind of men? Sailors
Cruel and bold—What kind of sailors? Pirates
Seen here—Pirates were seen here hanging for several days.
By eyes of old—a long time ago.

When you step into WPG from Meeting Street, the first thing you see is the Hunley Memorial that has a fountain (17). If you keep walking, you come to a gazebo that once served as a Band Stand (18).


Agreed and agreed. This is a very straightforward way to tell a hunter to begin at this park.

gajojo wrote:Stand and listen to the birds: I assume “stand” refers to the band stand(18). I have no idea what time of year BP was in Charleston, but I did find a website that stated that Yellow Crowned Night Herons nest every year in the oak trees in WPG. Maybe BP was there during this season??


Interesting! I need to check this out.

gajojo wrote:Hear the cool, clear song of water: I am assuming that this refers to either the Hunley fountain (17) and/or the river, ocean and harbor on the other side of the bandstand (low battery on map). Standing in the bandstand, you will have water on both sides. I am assuming the “clear song” refers to bandstand.

Harken the words: From the bandstand, head to to the Simms statue (16). Simms was a famous writer and orater, hence “Harken the words.”


Agreed, agreed, and agreed.

gajojo wrote:Point A (15) --Freedom at the birth of a century: No real clue, but I will throw out two thoughts. 1) I have wondered if this could refer to Liberia (in that Liberia means freedom). I don’t think it could have referred to Simms since from everything I have read, he was pro slavery. However, the verse seems to move to a contrast thing with the “Ors”, so maybe there is an intentional comparison of freedom vs. slavery—but how this line helps us find a casque is beyond me. 2) My other thought is that maybe “Freedom at the birth of a century” could refer to the Jasper Monument (15). Jasper distinguished himself in the defense of Fort Moultrie (then called Fort Sullivan) on June 28, 1776. Thomas Jefferson's wrote the Declaration of Independence in June of 1776. BP published the book in 1982. That is pretty close to the bicentennial. Could it be a nod toward 1776?—I wonder if that year is anywhere on the Jasper Monument. Century—100 years? Bicentennial—200 years? I know—it is a bad stretch, but from my perspective, this line either has nothing to do with any landmark in WPG (rather a Liberia reference) or it is has to do with the Jasper Monument.


The bicentennial is interesting to me...I think it potentially has ties to other locations as well, but this probably borderlines into conspiracy-theory-land. (e.g. Milwaukee's "grand 200" could have been a bicentennial trail sign or similar...)

gajojo wrote:Point B (8)--Or May 1913: This date was on the USS Maine Capstan.(was once located at #8)


Yes, I never found anything other than the capstan that had to do with "May 1913" in Charleston.

gajojo wrote:Beside the long palm's shadow: Initially, I saw this as having two options: either the palm of a hand on one of the statues or the really tall palm in WPG. If it was referring to the really tall palm, I wanted to see where the shadow of the tree fell at 4 pm. I thought maybe it would fall or point across the street toward the battery wall. I took this picture at 4 pm. Even if BP was there during a different time of year (spring forward or fall back Day light saving time), I don’t think the shadow is going to fall on anything near sand.


Yes, I've always liked that tree...but we know that shadow, taken literally, can only cast certain directions, which all point toward the center and north side of the park.

gajojo wrote:Side note: I have wondered if the flat center of the daisy referred to the Fort Sumter Monument at the corner of Murray Blvd and East Battery. (In the shadow of the tall palm picture above, the top of the shadow of the tall palm touched it.) I have seen aerial pictures of WPG where that monument looks like a flat disk. The monument is surrounded by what looks like 16 concrete petals. In image 2, the daisy has 17 petals. One is bent. When I look at it, it reminds me of “He loves me, He loves me not,” like I need to pull one off. No idea if this is what JPP was trying to convey. If there was sand around that monument in the 80’s, maybe the spot beside the shadow of the tall palm is significant.


Interesting on the daisy petals...I think the whole park is (was much more) pretty sand-covered.

gajojo wrote:Does anyone know if someone has tried to dig up this spot? Would love to have ya’lls thoughts. Please let me know if I need to clarify anything or if the pictures do not work. New to this.


That spot, not that I know of...
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Re: image 2

Postby tjgrey » Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:58 am

@gajojo

Forgot...Re:local art and museums

Google "anne worsham richardson" and look at her artwork...

It might not get us any further, but it might help piece together how these were constructed and where BP went.
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Re: image 2

Postby gajojo » Thu Sep 29, 2016 12:50 pm

Thanks tjgrey! Are you the one who lives in Charleston? If so, the next time you are at WPG, I would love it if you would go to that spot and turn and look at the white house. If that verse is actually talking about WPG, the last line felt right on point if it is in that spot. If Fort Sumter ferry doesn't lead you to Calhoun, then I am back to the drawing board. I also could easily see BP acting like a gardener digging in the bricked in part. I will definitely look up that artist. Thanks.
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Re: image 2

Postby JamesV » Fri Apr 14, 2017 7:36 pm

Hi all! I stumbled across "The Secret" last week, but I was instantly hooked so I just wanted to post a quick hello. I spent about 10 years living and working in the Charleston area, so Image 2 caught my attention immediately. (I'm leaning heavily toward Verse 5 for the pairing...)

Unfortunately I'm stuck exploring online for now since I won't be back in the Lowcountry for a few more months, but I'm amazed by how much devotion this group has shown to the puzzle. Thanks to everyone who's shared their thought processes so far!
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Re: image 2

Postby forest_blight » Fri Apr 14, 2017 8:52 pm

Welcome! I've been at it for 13 years now, and not one casque to show for it -- I hope you have better luck. 8)
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Re: image 2

Postby FlippinArkansas » Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:46 pm

gajojo wrote:


Point A (15) --Freedom at the birth of a century: No real clue, but I will throw out two thoughts. 1) I have wondered if this could refer to Liberia (in that Liberia means freedom). I don’t think it could have referred to Simms since from everything I have read, he was pro slavery. However, the verse seems to move to a contrast thing with the “Ors”, so maybe there is an intentional comparison of freedom vs. slavery—but how this line helps us find a casque is beyond me. 2) My other thought is that maybe “Freedom at the birth of a century” could refer to the Jasper Monument (15). Jasper distinguished himself in the defense of Fort Moultrie (then called Fort Sullivan) on June 28, 1776. Thomas Jefferson's wrote the Declaration of Independence in June of 1776. BP published the book in 1982. That is pretty close to the bicentennial. Could it be a nod toward 1776?—I wonder if that year is anywhere on the Jasper Monument. Century—100 years? Bicentennial—200 years? I know—it is a bad stretch, but from my perspective, this line either has nothing to do with any landmark in WPG (rather a Liberia reference) or it is has to do with the Jasper Monument.



There seems to be a fairly solid consensus that the "Freedom" line refers to Denmark Vesey, a Charleston slave who purchased his freedom after winning a lottery in 1799. There are several historical landmarks recognizing his place in Charleston history around the area of WPG. Also, there was a good amount of controversy around the time BP was putting The Secret together over a painting of Vesey that hangs in the Gaillard Municipal Auditorium. That said, new interpretations are always interesting to consider.
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Re: image 2

Postby erexere » Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:07 pm

Vesey has been a focal point at times but I think there's other considerations that might fit better.

Freedom also means Liberated.

"Freedom at the birth of a century" could be a person born in Liberia more than 100 years ago. Hilary Richard Wright Johnson (b. 1837) became the first African born President of Liberia in 1884.

The link that Charleston has to Liberia is significant and the connection of Liberia's Edward Wilmot Blyden as referenced to naming of twins Edwin and Edwina in Abroad in America also derserves consideration.
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Re: image 2

Postby FlippinArkansas » Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:22 pm

erexere wrote:Vesey has been a focal point at times but I think there's other considerations that might fit better.

Freedom also means Liberated.


Are you saying this is a reference to Liberia because freedom and liberation are synonyms? Why not just say "Liberated at the birth of a century" then?

erexere wrote:"Freedom at the birth of a century" could be a person born in Liberia more than 100 years ago. Hilary Richard Wright Johnson (b. 1837) became the first African born President of Liberia in 1884.


I'm not sure I follow. Why would BP speak of "the birth of a century" if he was just talking about something that happened 100 years ago? And I don't at all understand the connection to Hilary Richard Wright Johnson. He wasn't born anything close to 100 years before BP buried the casks and he became president less than 100 years before BP buried the casks. Therefore, no connection to birth or century exists.

erexere wrote:The link that Charleston has to Liberia is significant and the connection of Liberia's Edward Wilmot Blyden as referenced to naming of twins Edwin and Edwina in Abroad in America also derserves consideration.


Every clue doesn't have to connect to the same thing. For instance, the Haitian Revolution was also approximately at the birth of the 19th century and plenty of things COULD connect to that. I think BP mostly wanted to highlight a bunch of interesting historical truths about the places he buried the casques. There's way too much Denmark Vesey evidence to deny it as the most likely interpretation. I don't see any evidence that anything else "fits better."
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Re: image 2

Postby erexere » Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:11 pm

FlippinArkansas wrote:Are you saying this is a reference to Liberia because freedom and liberation are synonyms? Why not just say "Liberated at the birth of a century" then?


I think Preiss made a conscious choice to use the word freedom over liberated. Why that would be the case, I'm still guessing. For instance, I like the idea that "birth of a century" applies to the start or founding of our nation in 1776 and that "a century" could apply equally to either the first 100 years or second 100 years passing, thus the years 1877 and 1977 might pertain. I thought to cross reference Freedom and those dates and I discovered an interesting recipient for the Presidential Medal of Freedom, awarded to First Lady "Bird" Johnson in 1977. The subject of "birds" in the verse then being an important aspect of catching the reference to that particular First Lady.

I feel it's important to explore Charleston's connection to Liberia. Discovered in Abroad in America (pub. 1976) Edward Wilmot Blyden is a direct link to twins named Edwin and Edwina. After his stay in the United States in 1874, he traveled back to Liberia and wrote many letters supporting further efforts to emigrate freed African Americans, primarily the "Negro" as opposed to the "Mulatto". In 1878, a steamship left Charleston's port in what was known as the Liberian Exodus. http://docsouth.unc.edu/church/liberian/liberian.html

FlippinArkansas wrote:I'm not sure I follow. Why would BP speak of "the birth of a century" if he was just talking about something that happened 100 years ago? And I don't at all understand the connection to Hilary Richard Wright Johnson. He wasn't born anything close to 100 years before BP buried the casks and he became president less than 100 years before BP buried the casks. Therefore, no connection to birth or century exists.


Hilary R.W. Johnson is just a guess on my part. I wouldn't rule him out just for not being born exactly 100 years before Preiss hid the casques. His birth is significant in the same way as we would recognize Virginia Dare in N.C., she being the first "White" child born in the British Colonies of the New World, while Johnson is the first African born person in Liberia of African American decent. Consider the birth reference in the Litany of the Jewels: Africa's Diamond, earth born star, bright harvest of the midnight rock. I think it's justifiable to consider a connection to President Johnson of Liberia. At this time, the only conclusion I'm able to make is that the name "Johnson" helps us connect the events of the murder reported on April 8th, 1873 at the Cape Romaine Lighthouse by Keeper Andrew Johnson.

FlippinArkansas wrote:Every clue doesn't have to connect to the same thing. For instance, the Haitian Revolution was also approximately at the birth of the 19th century and plenty of things COULD connect to that. I think BP mostly wanted to highlight a bunch of interesting historical truths about the places he buried the casques. There's way too much Denmark Vesey evidence to deny it as the most likely interpretation. I don't see any evidence that anything else "fits better."


There's good historic context to consider Vesey's role in Charleston, but I'm not absolutely sure the verse has him in mind when it says "Freedom at the birth of a century". We have to keep asking ourselves WHY each piece of the verse/image puzzle is relevant. I agree that ever clue doesn't need to connect to the same thing. Often in the past, I would try too hard to establish multiple connects. Now, I try to see why a connection is necessary and to establish the accessibility of the supporting clues. I can Google all day, but that doesn't help me if someone couldn't pull out an Encyclopedia and look up something like this fine example for Denmark Vesey:

From the International Encyclopedia (pub. 1968) wrote:On May 30, 1822, two enslaved Afrikans betrayed Denmark Vesey, a free Afrikan who was planning the largest rebellion of enslaved Afrikans in United States history involving some 9,000 people.

Telemaque, later known as "Denmark Vesey" was born around 1767, probably on the Caribbean island of Saint Thomas. Joseph Vesey, a Carolina-based slaver, purchased the boy in 1781 as part of a cargo of 390 bondpeople. During the passage to the French colony of Saint-Domingue (Haiti), Vesey noticed the child’s “beauty, alertness, and intelligence” and employed him as a cabin boy. But when the ship reached Cap François, the captain “had no use for the boy” and turned him over to his colonial agents. Either traumatized by his new life in Saint-Domingue or feigning illness, the child began to display “epileptic fits.” Returned to the docks, a physician “certified that the lad” was unwell, which cancelled the sale. When Joseph Vesey returned to Cap François on April 23, 1782, with a new cargo of Gold Coast slaves, he was forced to take the child back. The fits promptly ceased, and Vesey decided to keep him as a servant.

Charleston authorities later described the child as a person of “superior power of mind & the more dangerous for it.” The captain saw only the value of a tall, muscular boy already conversant in two languages. Vesey gave the boy a new name, Telemaque, after the son of Homer’s Odysseus; over time, Carolina bondmen either punned or corrupted the name into Denmak, and then finally Denmark.

In the spring of 1783, following the British evacuation of South Carolina, Joseph Vesey settled into Charleston as a ship chandler. At some point during this period, Denmark married an enslaved woman named Beck. Beck had several masters over the course of her life, but she remained married to Denmark long enough to give birth to at least three of his children. Two of his sons were named Polydore and Robert; a third, Sandy, would be the only child to be implicated in his 1822 plot. Toward the end of his life, Denmark Vesey married again. His last wife, Susan, was born enslaved around 1795. She was the only woman to carry his surname. Some historians have speculated that Vesey practiced polygamy, although no evidence exists to support the theory.

On September 30, 1799, Denmark happened upon a handbill announcing the “East-Bay Lottery,” and bought a ticket. In November, Charleston newspapers declared his ticket the winner. The prize was $1,500, a princely sum that slaves who hired their time would take ten years to acquire. Joseph Vesey agreed to sell Denmark his freedom for $600; the contract was signed on December 31, 1799. After seventeen years as a Charleston slave, the thirty-three-year-old Denmark was free.

Chained to the South by family ties, Denmark remained in the city and apprenticed himself to a carpenter, an easy trade to learn and a lucrative business as Charleston expanded up the peninsula. At the same time, he adopted Vesey as a surname, probably as a linguistic tie to an established businessman whose name could help to secure clients. Vesey threw his enormous energies into his business, and according to one former slave, Denmark labored “every day at de trade of carpenter” and “soon became much [re]spected” and “esteem[ed] by de white folks.” But because of competition from white carpenters, free mulattoes (whose fathers provided business contacts), and enslaved craftsmen (who lived with their masters and paid no rent), Vesey barely maintained a modest income. Despite published claims made in 1822 that he died a rich man worth nearly $8,000, there is no evidence that Vesey ever owned a single piece of property.

Around 1818 Vesey joined the city’s new African Methodist Episcopal congregation, the center of Charleston’s enslaved community. Sandy Vesey also joined, as did four of Vesey’s closest friends: Peter Poyas, a literate ship carpenter; Monday Gell, an African-born Ibo who labored as a harness maker; Rolla Bennett, the manservant of Governor Thomas Bennett; and “Gullah” Jack Pritchard, an East African priest and woodworker purchased in Zinguebar in 1806. The temporary closure of the church by city authorities in June 1818 and the arrest of 140 congregants, one of them presumably Vesey, reinforced the determination of black Carolinians to maintain a place of independent worship and established the motivation for Vesey’s conspiracy. In 1820 several “Negroes was taken up” for holding a late-night service at the church, and city authorities warned that they would not tolerate class leaders conducting instructional “schools for slaves,” as “the education of such persons was forbidden by law.” The “African Church was the people,” Gell replied. He and Pritchard had considered insurrection in 1818, “and now they had begun again to try it.”

At the age of fifty-one, Vesey briefly thought about emigrating to the English colony of Sierra Leone. But as Beck’s children remained slaves, Vesey resolved instead to orchestrate a rebellion, followed by a mass exodus from Charleston to Haiti. President Jean-Pierre Boyer had recently encouraged black Americans to bring their skills and capital to his beleaguered republic. Vesey did not intend to tarry in Charleston long enough for white military power to present an effective counterassault. “As soon as they could get the money from the Banks, and the goods from the stores,” Rolla insisted, “they should hoist sail” for Saint-Domingue and live as free men.

Vesey planned the escape for nearly four years. His chief lieutenants included Poyas, Gell, Rolla Bennett, and “Gullah” Jack Pritchard. Although there are no reliable figures for the number of recruits, Charleston alone was home to 12,652 slaves. Pritchard, probably with some exaggeration, boasted that he had 6,600 recruits on the plantations across the Cooper and Ashley rivers. The plan called for Vesey’s followers to rise at midnight on Sunday, July 14—Bastille Day—slay their masters, and sail for Haiti and freedom. As one southern editor later conceded: “The plot seems to have been well devised, and its operation was extensive.”

The plot unraveled in June 1822 when two slaves revealed the plan to their owners. Mayor James Hamilton called up the city militia and convened a special court to try the captured insurgents. Vesey was captured at Beck’s home on June 21 and hanged on July 2, together with Rolla, Poyas, and three other rebels. In all, thirty-five slaves were executed. Forty-two others, including Sandy Vesey, were sold outside the United States; some, if not all, became slaves in Spanish Cuba. Robert Vesey lived to rebuild the African Church in the fall of 1865.
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Re: image 2

Postby erexere » Tue Apr 18, 2017 2:48 pm

Note the necklace chain of the Sumter medal here in image 2.

The first neck worn civillian medal in the US was introduced by Kennedy in 1963 by executive order 11085. The Presidential medal of Freedom... (superceeding Harry S. Truman's "Medal of Freedom" in 1945).
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Re: image 2

Postby FlippinArkansas » Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:57 pm

erexere wrote:
I think Preiss made a conscious choice to use the word freedom over liberated. Why that would be the case, I'm still guessing. For instance, I like the idea that "birth of a century" applies to the start or founding of our nation in 1776 and that "a century" could apply equally to either the first 100 years or second 100 years passing, thus the years 1877 and 1977 might pertain. I thought to cross reference Freedom and those dates and I discovered an interesting recipient for the Presidential Medal of Freedom, awarded to First Lady "Bird" Johnson in 1977. The subject of "birds" in the verse then being an important aspect of catching the reference to that particular First Lady.


As I said before, it's interesting to consider other possibilities but I don't really see the point of reaching for something with less connection to Charleston in a historical sense than Denmark Vesey. He's not just some random person. There are literally endless interpretations for the "birds" reference so why would Lady Bird Johnson be the one that makes the most sense, historically? What is her connection to Charleston?

erexere wrote:I feel it's important to explore Charleston's connection to Liberia. Discovered in Abroad in America (pub. 1976) Edward Wilmot Blyden is a direct link to twins named Edwin and Edwina. After his stay in the United States in 1874, he traveled back to Liberia and wrote many letters supporting further efforts to emigrate freed African Americans, primarily the "Negro" as opposed to the "Mulatto". In 1878, a steamship left Charleston's port in what was known as the Liberian Exodus. http://docsouth.unc.edu/church/liberian/liberian.html


Yes. The Edwin/Edwina line is another reference to Charleston's history. BP is walking us through some of the important historical and immigration connections to Africa. It really doesn't have to be complicated so unless there's some reason to focus on Liberia in Charleston, what's the point?

erexere wrote:Hilary R.W. Johnson is just a guess on my part. I wouldn't rule him out just for not being born exactly 100 years before Preiss hid the casques. His birth is significant in the same way as we would recognize Virginia Dare in N.C., she being the first "White" child born in the British Colonies of the New World, while Johnson is the first African born person in Liberia of African American decent. Consider the birth reference in the Litany of the Jewels: Africa's Diamond, earth born star, bright harvest of the midnight rock. I think it's justifiable to consider a connection to President Johnson of Liberia. At this time, the only conclusion I'm able to make is that the name "Johnson" helps us connect the events of the murder reported on April 8th, 1873 at the Cape Romaine Lighthouse by Keeper Andrew Johnson.


Is any of this supported by the image or the verse? You jump from "freedom" to liberation to Liberia to Hilary Johnson to Lady Bird Johnson to a murderous lighthouse keeper who also happens to have the same name (a very, very, very common one at that) to lead us to Cape Romaine? Again, any of this supported elsewhere?

erexere wrote:There's good historic context to consider Vesey's role in Charleston, but I'm not absolutely sure the verse has him in mind when it says "Freedom at the birth of a century". We have to keep asking ourselves WHY each piece of the verse/image puzzle is relevant.


In the painting of Denmark Vesey that hangs in the Gaillard Auditorium (blocks from WPG) he is portrayed from behind with the congregation "harken[ing] to the words" that he's speaking. His house (most likely not his actual house) is an historical landmark in Charleston (blocks from WPG) and he was instrumental in founding the AME church in Charleston, which is kind of a big deal, historically. Why is all of this important? Most likely BP wanted searchers to understand the deep connections between DV and the city of Charleston, particularly because he had become a controversial figure in the late 1970s when BP was doing his research. Denmark Vesey might not get us closer to the casque but that is the case with so many of the clues. Obviously your time is your own but it seems to me that there are other more controvertible parts to this puzzle which may be more worthy.
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Re: image 2

Postby erexere » Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:49 pm

Yes, Johnson is a common name. I'm exploring and explaining just one approach best I can. I'm not saying its the best approach, just an option for consideratuon, so you might want to adjust the tone of your arguement.

Note the use of the word "or" being used to connect the various lines after "harken". I believe that LINK is expected to be some commonality. What is that?

Harken, by the way, doesnt mean only spoken words, just words that are given special attention, written or otherwise. Im exploring the track that harken is being used in the sense that there is a subject of leadership involved. We might harken to Vesey leading a revolt, or MLK delivering his speech, or the words of our President. I explored the name Johnson first as common as it is when I learned the Keeper story, significant for a number of reasons: April 8th event (on the eighth a scene), being a murder (the scene of a crime), his wife buried a box of diamond jewelery and other valuables on the Cape Romaine island (Treasure on an Island ties in with the Robert Louis Stevenson reference), Cape Romaine's two lighthouses might be thought of as twins (giving reason for the use of Edwin/Edwina), and the Keepers name was Andrew Johnson same as the Vice President of Abraham Lincoln (White house close at hand, such as when VP becomes acting President as happened when Lincoln was shot at the theater).

I've looked into the "neck order" selection of medals introduced in US history. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neck_order
Medals of Honor, Merit, Valor, Freedom, etc. If the medal of Sumter featuring a single star in image 2 is any indication, then the medal of Freedom is possibly an accessible idea readers of the Secret in 1982. I dont know the details of the public record for the Presidential Medal of Freedom, but in combination with "birth of a century" being specifically the first year of a century in terms of US with a beginning year of 1776, then 1877 and 1977 are both candidates. As common as the name Johnson may be, there is room for consideration that "Bird" Johnson is an important discovery as we stand and listen (hearken) to the birds.

Also, in terms of lat and long, Cape Romaine isnt to be ruled out, since people have argued that it is too far away from Charleston. If the lat/long are to be adhered to, than any place within about 50 miles is possible, since then you'd be looking at a new lat or long, thats what it means to be "too far away".

My guess about Liberias first African born President is just a guess. Its possibly a blip on the "radar" or its just coincidental. He ties in only vaguely given he held the same job as Blyden as Secretary of Foreign Affairs and later became President. His birth has importance only as much as people might argue some detail about Virginia Dare in search of Image 3's casque near Roanoke, since she was the first American born English person of the Colonies. The question is whether this information is accessible to BP's 1982 audience and whether it fits his paradigm for the Fair Folk treasure hiding. I think he uses uniquely important details and makes work for the keen observer. Symbolism and near exact matches are blended in to carry specific ideas that point to a location. If there is a "bar that binds" to be found at Cape Romaine's lighthouses, then I think the water cistern drum barrel standing above ground is an option. A "bar" is a place you might go if you're thirsty, so why not go to a water cistern which holds (hold = to bind) water.

Returning to the linking of ideas after harken: perhaps fatboaC refers to Lady "Bird" Johnson receiving the Presidential Medal of Freedom, perhaps Edwin/Edwina's Blyden links us to Liberia, perhaps May 1913 is the birth if the most recent Liberian President Tolbert, and perhaps April 8th is our murder scene involving a man with the same full name as a US President, Andrew Johnson, same last name as a previous Liberian President in Blyden's time, same last name as a "Bird". Maybe thats what our harkening is to determine.
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